And this?
2008? - OMG that's SOOOO long ago...!
Okay how about this little chestnut from last year...?
Okay how about this little chestnut from last year...?
There was a recent blog comment on the mixed race article posted by a White teenager:
'Considering your blog is about anti-Chinese racism, is it fair to say you are also racist to Whites, Blacks, Indians and other non-Chinese'?
I replied ' You wouldn't understand, you're not Chinese' This comment was immediately followed, by a presumably regular BBC reader who asked, 'Why don't you answer him ? Because you know he's right isn't it?'
To which I replied- ' Are you white too, or just white-washed?'
With the western economy faltering, these days, it's understandable where the first commentor, in typical selfish mercenarial interest would exploit his self-entitled white privilege in the Far East to get it on with a Chinese girl. After all, surely that's what visiting the Far East is largely about for white males? To create 'Asian fusion culture'?
But that as a BBC, I would have to defend my racial stance to a white person, and then get suddenly shot down by another BBC... is quite frankly, pathetic.
As you can see from articles here for clues as to the upbringing of a BBC with ignorant FOB parents with the white environment default.... and here as to clues as to BBC solidarity in terms of who they would speak out for when it came down to it - me or a non-Chinese....
Due to being so hampered by social engineering , BBC social identity hasn't been able to develop due to our mental 'space' filled with with liberal multiculturalist 'equality', a lack of real strong Chinese role models outside our own family, adopting white viewpoints, deifying the idea of having mixed race offspring, in actual fact, it's little surprise the aforementioned exchange happened.
In civil society, we have to get on with all kinds of people, but in understanding racial construct, if being 'racist to White/Asian/Black' is the way to go forward to create that mindspace for our Chinese identity to develop, then so be it. With the amount of selling out/white-washing we ethnic Chinese do/have been/is being done to us, having an actual separatist cultural mindset in this day and age, ought to be considered a great sign of self respect.
And why feel guilty about it? In a supposed equal British multicultural society, we are dominated by White advertising, white beauty adverts, white film stars, largely white government workers, with other British ethnic representation on the fringes of British society, even on TV , South Asians and Blacks are accepted as normal but rare appearances of ethnic Chinese...if female, hypersexualised and if male...invisible as usual.
Do you Confucian-minded BBCs really want to add to our own BBC exclusion by calling me racist?
In a white-is normal default environment , the more you side with a non-Chinese in identity and viewpoint and outlook, the less security you will have in your own ethnic Chinese social identity, and as long as you are an ethnic Chinese, your racial appearance is what you will be judged on.
Has anyone of you readers been on the receiving end of what I call 'inter-ethnic discrimination'?
Inter-ethnic discrimination is when a white-washed British ethnic minority makes a derogatory comment or behaves in a patronising way simply because you are a Chinese.
For example, last year, when I was coming back home from a night out on town with my friend - a group of South Asian lads - one in particular, being all boisterous on a Saturday night suddenly pointed at my ethnic Chinese friend and started laughing at him, that was looking grumpy - actually he had just lost at the Casino.
That my friend is 6ft tall, tough looking and not at all 'wimpy' looking didn't stop this boisterous group of South Asians to happily mock away. At the time my friend ignored it and as typical with these brief exchanges, the incident was over way before your mind can even register it.
In another incident, two years ago, I was with another friend, squinting to view the cinema timetable to see what was showing, when of two South Asian lads, queuing up to see a film - one started smirking because of the way I was squinting to view the cinema times.
They caught me looking at them, and because he was feeling excited about queuing for his Bollywood film, did a little mocking Indian dance as if to fob me off.
In quick retort, I devilishly whispered into my friend's his ear something about my self-designated nemesis being a rubberlimbed Dhalsim ( Character from the original Streetfighter arcade game) and we both started to smirk back at his dancing which shut him up as he immediately stopped dancing and turned away.
Inter-racial discrimination is one end product of ethnics being forced to 'integrate' into British social culture because this is precisely the way racist whites behave. And obviously the surprising thing, is that in ethnic company, you least expect it from another ethnic minority. Which is also why I have issues with BBCS becoming so white-washed - because at that level, it's not impossible to imagine even a BBC being anti-Chinese to another ethnic Chinese.
And with remarks from those same ignorant BBC's like 'Stop being a wimp if you think everything is racist'or 'you should learn self-defense' actually only empowers the seemingly 'casual' part of casual racism because apart from the need for that BBC to save face by acting the selfish tough-guy, it does very little for those actually unable to defend themselves , against the physical, mental threat and very real socially acceptable war own global Chinese population, have willingly or unwillingly, knowingly or unknowingly, been positioned to fight back against.
Dealing with inter-ethnic discrimination is never easy, but is it right to for BBC's to be equally discriminating back? And if not then how would you deal with it? Because by not acting out against it, we only perpetuate the myth in a western society that we are a pushover culture, something that our FOB parents have done little to prevent.
Bastard why is it me with the first comment? I suppose I should say SOFA. As is common on Chinese forums.
ReplyDeleteAnyway I think you are looking at it in a slightly wrong way. This is of course MY opinion and I could well be wrong. In that China isn't really unified. Look at a microcosm. Hong Kong. Just the Han Chinese in their OWN land:
The Cantonese look down on the Hakka.
The Hakka dispise the Cantonese (due to being nearly wiped out in the wars). While both look down on mainlanders. If you ever get my uncles drunk you will hear endless stories of hate between Hakka and Cantonese types. My cousins are most confused due to be half Cantonese and Hakka. You see the division in this?
And everybody looks down on darker south Asian people.
Anyway it depends tbh. Not just a confusian value In that it is something that Nietzsche said.
"He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you"
In a modern sense its a case of going down to their level. Should you or shouldn't you? And this fails to address the problem is people WILL accuse you of pulling the race card. Even if it is completely legitimate.
Rock and a hard place?
On a tangent thought. Have you ever seen the Simpsons episode with the bear? Homer wants to fight the bear the way of the man. That is to destroy his habitat and poison his food and water. Seems to me China not for a noble cause or for our behalf is doing this. Three months ago a CCP shell company bought a water company. This week Weetabix.
As far as I'm aware Hakka is just a dialect, not an ethnicity in the Far East, therefore its not a big deal if Hakka marry Cantonese, they're both Chinese. Hardly any Hong Kongers these days who are of Hakka speaking heritage even speak Hakka, even if they know it, they don't speak it.
DeleteI always assumed most of us are just BBC of Hong kong origin until I started blogging, but now I've noticed that the Facebook BBC group appears to be overrun with self-deprecating Hakka BBC, it may explain why they're so pro inter racial marriage.
For example, if 'hakka people' along with every other 'non-cantonese' (such as mainlander from Shanghai, Jiangsu, etc) many hakka BBC cannot speak Cantonese, are transient perpetually migrating people, then there is no reason for them to marry another Chinese is there? Since there is no base heritage to prolong or return to. As far as I'm aware, there are no statistics on Hakka marriages in the UK, but if there were, I'll be very interested to see Hakka BBC inter racial marriage rates, I'm guessing they're high.
answer no, racism is wrong, irrelevant which race it is.btw cantonese don't look down on hakkas you don't know f**k all, many HK stars are hakka, it don't know mean sh*t.
ReplyDeleteI was actually approaching the angle from a BBC point of view, but to address your points.Re Cantonese looking down on Hakka. Not sure why this debate is constantly brought up, but I have Hakka ancestry in my family, so no issues there, and I dont think BBCz has either, as I recall he has said his family's village dialect is similar to Hakka. But in my opinion, this is not about Chinese tribalism, because we are not in 18th century China anymore, obviously.
ReplyDeleteAnd to non-Chinese , whether they are white, brown or whatever, would they care whether we are Hakka, Cantonese, Mainland Chinese or even Vietnamese? Probably not.
'he who fights monsters becomes a monster.' To be more accurate, I think its becoming a monster to show your enemy who he is, and that he is not all he's cracked up to be.
Obviously picking our confrontations carefully, as we both agreed on on the last post, If a british african ( for sake of argument) made some derogatory remark towards me, taking into account the physical repercussions, why shouldnt I say something back?
If they do play the race card, I can do the same. Even whites are doing this now
http://bbczeitgeist.blogspot.co.uk/2012/02/reverse-discrimination.html
Bottom line, everyone plays the 'race' card except us Chinese whether confucian genetics,or saving face or even because we think we are 'above it' and that maybe, just maybe, we think we are a majority ( ie the last remaining civilisation that hasnt been colonised by westerners) that has led some kind of complacency in UK chinese women which which aside from outbreeding racism its also another way of 'empowering' themselves with the perceived power of white privilege.
I agree China is taking over UK businesses on behalf of China, and not for BBCs, but indirectly it may have a more reverent or fearful attitude for China and ethnic Chinese because China are a risng power.
But If Eurasians are jumping on the China bandwagon, and even some whites, shouldnt us ethnic Chinese? It's long overdue, BBC culture or no culture, BBCs IMO ought to assume a more arrogant Chinese racial pride stance towards other non-Chinese, for our own identity self definition as BBCs.
Id even go as far to say that Forming BBC pride is based on defining how we see ourselves in relation to other UK non-Chinese.
Your China-self interest argument doesnt work entirely when you mention a Chinese company is buying weetabix, because if so how the hell did it empower this guy, a Chinese student, where the instigator of the 'accident' was put back on duty straight after killing someone?
http://bbczeitgeist.blogspot.co.uk/2012/04/police-car-kills-chinese-student.html
No, you dont have to be an mainlander to see that our whole Chinese identity requires mandatory assertion.
Even if it means being racist, to a non-Chinese, then its necessary, because not too long ago, those same non-Chinese wouldnt have given a crap about doing the same thing back to us, as we can clearly see in the photos above.
Very confusing article with a misleading title. The article appears to be about inter ethnic racism, yet you have used three photo illustrations of White Caucasian racism towards Chinese which is unrelated to inter ethnic racism.
ReplyDeleteI don't know why you say the term inter ethnic discrimination/racism implies ethnic minorities are white washed if they're racist to Chinese? Isn't that like saying if Chinese are racist to Blacks or Indians, its because Chinese are white washed? Far from it, its more likely because Chinese are racially proud and recognise indifference, they haven't taken on or adopted the white agenda at all. I don't think racial prejudice by Chinese against non-Chinese is directly related to white washing.
I'm having problems with blogger - I found a photo of Ronaldo doing the gesture, which is the closest I can find to an ethnic person doing it, but it wont let me submit changes. Also the title does say 'Non-Chinese'. Although maybe I could have put 'inter-ethnic racism' as a sub-heading.
DeleteRe: whitewashed Chinese, not finding words like 'Chink' offensive. Typically in my experience a Chinese in a group of white people would not acknowledge you as another Chinese. If those whites started mocking a stranger ( myself or someone else), I'll bet , the Chinese in their company will probably do nothing to stop them. In that respect, its like a passively condoned racism ie by not being proactive against it, it is condoned. The Miley Cyrus incident is another example of a clueless whitewashed Chinese, who would do nothing to help me out, i'll bet, if his white friends suddenly decided to jump me.
Re other ethnics being racist towards Chinese. And vica versa. Those same South Asians in the above examples were offensively racist. In the same above example I was defensive. IMO offensive racism or stance that whites use, is what I call 'whitewashed' or 'white superiority' that these same ethnics adopt. Like some hidden hierarchy, which you can see if you study UK TV media storylines, adverts - how many Chinese appear, how many asians appear, how many blacks appear, how do we get to know them as people, to what extent they are fetishised or objectified etc.
As far as I know only FOBS say Gweilo, Huk Gwei but it's usually muttered privately, never to the other person's face, unless in the FOB'S place of work or in the company of other FOBS. So yes that is Chinese pride, and a trait that BBCS could consider verbally adopting to strengthen our own sense of pride, along with our own brand of anti-non Chinese racism justifiably in a racially defensive stance.
The Mark Allen case is a recent example, he apologized for his comment and also deleted his twitter account. But that doesn't mean he's no longer racist, merely careful about what he says in public, his racism will be kept private away from the public eye.
ReplyDeleteOften, its necessary to fight racism with racism. Constantly publishing news articles on racism against Chinese, the Chinese are presented as passive victims of racism, it can create a perpetual victim status. The alternative is to write articles with blatant Chinese arrogance and racial pride... rather like how White people write about China, which I've found results in accusations of racism and sexism. But that's ok, if whites write about Chinese negatively and full of stereotyping, I will reciprocate.
I disagree zeit, by reciprocating racism with racism it leads to further conflict, that doesn't resolve the matter, it just leads to fight and more conflict, my take is to negate it by outlining its igonorance. the fact that there are non racist people and in my small world, fortunately the majority and not the minority. The article subtext doesn't do much favours in discussing race as a us vs them attitude, i agree racism is nasty but that is only one side, there are too many intelligence kind people in this world, reach out to them, rather than stirring up conflict and further alienation.
ReplyDeleteYou do not solve racism your way either. If you're asking whether I like conflict, then yes, I would rather have conflict than than passive mediocrity.
ReplyDeleteThis is a good example today in Australia of an attack on chinese.
"A gang of hooligans attacked us. Our noses are fractured and our bodies are covered in blood. My friend's cheekbone was crushed. They attacked us with glass and burnt us with lit cigarettes. My face is burnt and totally disfigured! Worst of all, I really hated their racist comments.
"They were calling us Asian dogs and pussies while they were beating us. When my friend tried to wipe blood from his nose, a teenaged girl stuffed my friend's mouth with her tampon removed from her pants.”
Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/national/chinese-students-at-risk-in-australia-20120426-1xn5v.html#ixzz1tB6NhjNd
Notice they called the Chinese pussies. Why do you think they called them that? Because Chinese don't fight back. They wouldn't call a Black person a pussy would they? Note the attacks on Indians also in Australia, you think sitting on your backside in peace like Gandhi is going to solve anything these days?
You do not rationalise with racists, you do not solve racism by being a passive wimp. You fight back. If you're racist to me, I will reciprocate, in fact, a better idea is if Chinese people go one step further and be the racial aggressor, that's really what Chinese people should be doing, but maybe they're wimpish for that.
@BBC I agree 100%. We should Chinese should more outwardly aggressive towards other nations and other non-Chinese. Its an aggressive western world and we need to operate in it as such.
ReplyDelete@anonymous. No offense, but I dont think we BBCs or Chinese in the UK for that matter, can get more alienated than we already are. We already know the BBC geographical dispersal statistics, the general apathy of British Chinese community, my point is, by fighting fire with fire, in a defensive situation needed as and when, and tactically, throwing the same 'humour'back in their face simply, you gain respect as an individual, and also win respect for our people.
It may not fix BBC geographical dispersal, but it shows we have balls and that we ethnic Chinese fight back. And that is exactly what most of these cowardly sheep in wolves clothing instigators dont expect.
Cool logical argument or forceful diplomacy does the job , but it can get a bit exhausting having to justify your Chinese humanity constantly on a constant basis when you have done nothing to deserve such attention apart from being perceived as 'an easy target'
ReplyDeleteIn my experience, cool and rational to disarm without intimidation creates only temporary disarmament for the individual, the same way a bouncer breaks a fight between two people, doesnt stop those two from going at it again outside.
Because of the personal nature of casual racism, some get it more than others. I dont as much as I used to, but for someone who constantly does, how far will cool and rational take him?
Maybe offline youre a friendly popular guy who doesnt attract trouble as much gets on with everyone. If so, lucky you. There are people like this, who no doubt also subscribe to karmic peaceful goodwill to all men mantra, which is i agree is the right policy.
However, in reality analysing the science of why some Chinese get more shit than others there are few answers, and for me, I only stopped getting hassle once I really made my mark. And no it wasnt norway nutcase style.
Because of the nature and speed of blink and its gone 'jokey' casual slightism - and that our slumbering British Chinese analogous identity of Chinese groceries and hot food,does little to solve it, a sharp reverse racism retort can be sometimes the only solution.
And as long as most Chinese dont recognise racism as a social epidemic rather than the usual face-saving 'as long as i can handle it, screw other Chinese' attitude as we've seen on this blog, as usual, it's every man for himself.
Given that 'you're on yer own' isolation that most Chinese have, for those who are unable to fight or reason back for whatever reason ( lack of confidence, slow witted, etc), its internalised worse, leaving it up to those who can manage conflict to speak out for those who cannot,with reverse racial mockery if need be.
Cool rational disarmament alone has only temporary effect,but implementing some jokey racial mockery tactics, in the same casual way that those same oppressors wouldnt think twice about doing to you, shows Chinese pride and shows that we as a whole,are not pushovers, in my experience.
Re: AnonymousApr 26, 2012 05:10 PM
ReplyDeleteYoure naive. Dating is an example of legal racial discrimination, Black women are at the bottom of the racial preference list for most races. I will never marry a arab muslim, Indian nor Black woman. That is my racial preference, which is a form of racial discrimination, which is is a form of racism.
We are BBC's, we write from a BBC perspective, we want to create a BBC community, we want to empower BBC's. Why do we do that for BBCs and not for the Black, Indian or White community? Because we're British Born Chinese. Birds of a feather flock together. Yes, its a form of racism.
'oh lets be nice to each other and hold hands and have nice mixed race babies, we're all part of the same race, the human race.' This is just a mainstream White multi-culturalist view, not a Chinese view, such an opinion is dis-empowering for our Chinese race and our BBC identity.
See point 7....
http://bbczeitgeist.blogspot.co.uk/p/general-rules-for-posting-comments.html
I've given examples of racism against Chinese in the replies which are ignored, instead, you comment about how Chinese people shouldn't use racial slurs against other races...
"My chinese friend don't use words like hut gwei, nor mo-lor-cahr nor do my non-chinese friends ever use the word chink, ignorant chinese people yes."
You refuse to condemn racism against Chinese and only condemn Chinese people who use racial slurs. That results in one-way racism against Chinese people because you forbid reprisals. You want to prevent Chinese people from returning fire. That's zero resistance cowardice, maybe you should re-read:
http://bbczeitgeist.blogspot.com/2012/03/fight-racism.html
It shows the strength of indoctrinated multi-cultural education. The British education system tries to white wash BBCs into being British White people to carry their white mans burden for them. Too many multi-culturally washed out, black-washed or brown-washed BBC's are unable to associate fighting racism with Chinese and can only associate fighting racism with a heroic hakgwei MLK and an heroic achar Gandhi. Re-read this:
ReplyDeletehttp://bbczeitgeist.blogspot.com/2012/01/once-you-go-black-you-cant-go-back.html
BTW, mainstream history books wont tell you Gandhi was extremely racist towards Blacks because its un-PC to tarnish the reputation of a multicultural agenda driven brown hero.
Why make irrelevant comparisons with Brevik? When black people show pride its legitimate -Martin Luther King, when Indians show racial pride - its legitimate Gandhi, when Chinese show pride, its illegitimate its Brevik!!!! Yeah that's right, that very Chinese person called Brevik!
Chinese people are not permitted to show Chinese pride, its bad enough when white people don't allow it, but even worse when you have sell out BBCs and mixed raced idiots like those involved in the Takeaway the Musical forbidding specifically their own race from expressing 'Chinese pride,' instead Chinese are only allowed to be multiculturally proud mixed with black indians whites etc.
SO why does this happen? Because BBCs are so white washed, they have bought into the white mans burden and are now the resellers of the whites man multicultural agenda. The white man has passed their burden onto you. You are are idiot for buying into it.
Its as illogical as insisting anyone who uses the word Jew makes them a Nazi, white people are scared of a return to history, its their burden. We are not white, Chinese were not responsible for the white man's war crimes, we have no burden. No White Brit is going to dispense their colonial guilt and white burden onto me - a Chinese.
I disagree. My own TA has minor problems. I sometimes give customers a nasty peeved off look. If they say something out of order.
ReplyDeleteIt is rare though as I've developed good relationships with most customers.
I understand why a lot of TA owners won't react. It is because they feel transitory. You're just here to make money not friends. The world is filled with crap. But just keep busy and keep making money. As it is all transitory.
Brevik?
ReplyDeleteParallels. Ask your parents about the 70s and 80s. There was an event sometime in the 70s it is absolutely notorious.
Many of the older Chinese believe it was a turning point. Where a restaurant. Simply the owner fought back.
I won't go into details, but three men ended up as vegetables. One of the men even begged for mercy. But was given no quarter. He lost a LOT of business for a long time. But nobody ever gave him any shit again. The police knew he was guilty as hell but could prove nothing as well.
white black brown , in China eyes all are SHIT
ReplyDeleteGun ni mar!
Omg, I can't believe what I'm seeing and reading. Whatever colour or race we are, we all suffer parts of racism and prejudice. I am a BBC. Nice to meet you all.
ReplyDeleteNice to meet you, and welcome.
DeleteWould you use racist tactics to defend yourself against someone who made anti-Chinese slurs at you?
^ Whilst I can respect that from a business point of view, this is exactly why our British Chinese social identity goes round in circles because if we dont have an actively de-orientalising or anti-sinophobic media/culture outside what we are known for, cannot corner any other niche like indians monopolize cornershops and petrol stations, and the only times whites actually socialise with Chinese is when they want to order a takeaway, and as long as we treat sinophobic attitudes as transitory, there's little reason for the casual racism social cycle to not continue.
ReplyDeleteAnd as long as it does, in my mind, with the right preparation, and right distance, fight fire with fire is justified.
@BBCz 'multicultural agenda driven brown hero' HAHAHAHAHA
ReplyDeleteAnd to add to what you said above, because we BBCs are so out of touch with our own unique sense Chinese pride we are left armless with no way to deal with racism, as you rightly say we assume the white man's colonial burden and have become this fluffy mindless ethereal multicultural burden of political correctness.
ReplyDeleteOur attitude to racism and how we deal with it, aside from not having mixed race children, and supporting a BBC media, is an equally important factor when it comes to defining the real potential of British Born Chinese cultural identity and pride.
It depends on what it is. I've been racially abused when I was in school, so yes I did defend myself. At first, I had ignored the bullies, but then the problem got worse, and consequently, had to inform the headteacher.
ReplyDeleteOkay, did you ever feel you wanted to use anti-racist slurs back at that non-Chinese? Aside from informing the head-teacher, how did you personally defend yourself? With racism? With words? What did you say at him/her etc.
DeleteSee, your experience, once again sums up why we ethnic Chinese need to deal with racism as a collective. A BBC media with willing participants to share real issues rather than the usual bland crap we are known for talking about.
DeleteIn meantime, free to email the blog owner bbczeitgeist@hotmail.co.uk if you ever want to chat, or sign up for a google ID, to submit an article if you have any issues you'd care to write about, thanks for sharing.
Thanks happy. People just don't understand how it feels to be emotionally scarred for life. It does bring back flashbacks, even my best friend wasn't there to support me. I was deeply hurt by it all. In my previous employments, I was also bullied. Maybe I have the word "shitface" written all over my forehead. I am really disgusted by the racism remarks made by people. We should all learn how to love one another, no matter if we're black, white, yellow, brown etc.
DeleteWe should all learn to love one another, and with respect to you as an individual,and im guessing, a female?
DeleteHope you have a way to cope with what you went and probably still are going through.
But as an individual, and male, who has also been through what you go through, and this is just me, I would not hesitate to using a quick 'jokey' racial retort to attack other racists, because in my experience, it really is the best way to get things solved there and then. Esp when theres no support ( you are on your own) and the antagonists assume the typically common cowardly group stance.
An aggressive racial stance combined with a quick wit to fire back at a sinophobic non-Chinese shows we Chinese are not to be messed with.
I understand what you mean. Yes I'm a female. What happens if the situation gets out of hand? Even though if we did defend ourselves, the problem would still be there. It's a catch 22. I know we shouldn't keep the silence, but my mum has always teached me to ignore them. I was reading up the Stephen Lawrence racial murder case going back in the early 90's and he couldn't defend himself because there were a gang of white youths ganging up and chanting racist slogans at him. If you were in his shoes happybritishchinese, how would you deal with it? Would you use your martial art skills on them? Hee hee.
DeleteHopefully others can chip in here and suggest, seeing as its an open blog, but I would suggest logical protectionist solutions:
Delete1. get some mates who can walk with you to school to shops etc or at least get some company
2. stay in daylight and avoid walking at night and if you have to stay under lamposts
3. yes, take up martial arts, for your confidence if anything else, and in case you do get into close quarters.
4. when nearby, walk away from them as fast as possible.
This sounds like a real situation, and im no counsellor but if you live in a heavy white-skav area because of your mums takeaway or something, then you probably
a/ have no choice but to stick it out until your folks move
b/ probably have no Chinese around you who can support you
Id also suggest your local Chinese community centre if there is one, or Citizens advice bureau.
Apart from not going to school, theres not much else i can suggest. You sound like youre in a delicate situation, and if you live in an area full of whites, have no friends, have no chinese mates to walk home with, your mum/folks are busy working with no time etc, obviously im not going to condone being racist to them, unless its from a safe distance, and you never see them again, but from the sounds of it, it sounds that they are regular chav locals who have nothing to do except bum around doing nothing all day looking for excuses to cause trouble.so , best avoided.
In terms of physical self defense, id take up some close combat martial arts, like wing chun ,which ought to teach you if they are armed with a knife you can handle it. Preferably get trained a high level, corner one of them, preferably the leader, alone, if you know him, seeing as he/she is a regular, wait for them to antagnise you and then insult them back, and when he or she attacks, take him/her out ie break the part of the body that he/she attacks you with.
DeleteTaking out their leader quickly, can show the rest of the cowards/bullies you mean business.
^dear oh dear, I think you have been watching one too many fantasy Kung Fu movies, you are not being realistic.
DeleteTheres no help in her area, im assuming, the best thing she can do is defend herself. If she was older than them it may make a difference but im guessing they are all the same age and they are locals which means she has to pass by them every day. What do you suggest?
DeleteI've lived in my area for a while and the neighbours keep themselves to themselves. What happened was in the past when I was in secondary school. It's good to have some self defence martial arts skills like you had suggested. I will look into that. I've suffered with racism worse in secondary school, but now, I still get the odd occasional times when I'm going into town or with people I meet.
DeleteWhen I was working for the CAB a few years ago, a guy had rung up to say his job was taken by Polish workers. I just didn't know how to answer him back really. It's a racist remark. Another time, when I was reading a letter written by a local Chinese girl, she was filing a complaint against her White boss, as he didn't give her any holiday time in London and was badly treated by the staff members there.
We can all be prejudiced towards non-Chinese or even 100% Chinese. Can't we? I've joined a website called www.weibo.com and it's written in simplified and traditional Chinese. I mostly go there because I want to learn Mandarin or possibly make friends. My written Chinese is really bad and on a few occasions, I was told by people there not to use the site, as I could only write in English. Just recently, Donnie Yen's wife was mocked by writing in English and she's a Canadian Chinese. What do you think of 100% Chinese taking the piss out of BBC's, CBC's, ABC's etc?
'taking the piss' = not 'Chinese enough'
DeleteThats a typical FOB trait. 'you dont speak Cantonese and you call yourself Chinese!'
Those FOBS that dont know what an overseas Chinese is in 2012, means they just dont know about anything outside their own country and if they are taking the piss out of you for it, just take the piss out of their English grammar.
Thats one of the main reasons IMO BBCs need to have a visible media presence based on developing our own sense of Chinese pride, because if we dont, in british society, we are just seen as Chinese looking, non-Chinese language speakers.
As far as 100% Chinese ie ethnic Chinese ( us) taking the piss out of each other read this
http://bbczeitgeist.blogspot.co.uk/2012/03/how-to-become-sellout-bbc-in-5-steps.html
In the above example, getting racism from white/non Chinese then endorsing white values is like a reminder to that whitewashed bbc he/she may need to brush up on his own sense of Chinese pride, which at times can be challenging especially when we dont have our own culture or point of reference to relate to each other apart from white culture and FOB culture.
On the plus side, a BBC can have more Chinese pride than a FOB who speaks many dialects but is a complete whitewashed sellout
http://bbczeitgeist.blogspot.co.uk/2011/12/chinese-classical-music.html
BBCs can get abuse from all angles,from blacks, whites, browns, FOBS, through no fault of our own, so by examining our own psychology and building our own sense of Chinese pride, we can create a sense of solidarity for ourselves, without being dictated as to how we should be seen/ not seen by non-Chinese racists/Chinese sellouts.
@ happybritishCCCChinese, that is funny,sounds like your parents not FOB,or your grandparents not FOB,i feel sorry for you parents,they must feel sad having a son hate them just because they are FOB,I feel sorry you still mark yourself as part of chinese,and mark some others chinese whitewash,sellout,,,if that why just leave them alone,just put mark on your "selfhated BBC".
DeleteHappy, I just don't know what to write really. I wouldn't judge a book by its cover. I know a lot of Chinese people would do this a great deal, and one thing, I don't like is being compared to, say for instance, a family relative looks up to their daughter that is married to a local born Chinese, but another family member's daughter gets married to an Asian Indian or a White guy. There'll be a lot of gossip and possibly their parents would disown their daughter because she got married to an Asian Indian or a White guy. Okay, according to family Chinese traditions, we should pass on our Chinese culture to the next generation, but what happens if we don't want to? It doesn't mean that they are whitewashed. It's just that they were brought up in a White man's country and they are used to that culture, which of course, isn't their fault. You shouldn't really be prejudiced towards BBC's at all. I could say to you, ok, you're a BBC, but can you write and speak Cantonese or Mandarin fluently? If you can't, then, that would mean that you're a jook sing or gwai lo haha..but anyway, maybe they are very happy in marrying to an Asian Indian or a White guy. At least, they are not lonely, and Chinese parents nowadays, shouldn't deprive their children's rights in doing things that they don't want to, like studying longer hours, getting a top professional job, prevent them from going out late at night blah blah blah. There are some things I do disagree with when Chinese parents have control over their children. Does that make me a whitewashed BBC? Well happy, we shouldn't think too negative, otherwise it will get us nowhere. I am trying my best to be happy in life although I don't like UK very much.
DeleteHappy are you happy being a BBC? How would you rate yourself in being Chinese? Are there any areas that you feel you show signs of being a whitewash lol? Do you follow the Chinese traditions and occasions? Are you superstitious lol? Do you believe in fengshui? Do you insist in marrying someone of your own colour/culture? Do you have high expectations in looking for a partner? Haha.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteFor the personal ones, which have nothing to do with this article you can send me an email to the blog bbczeitgeist@hotmail.co.uk.
DeleteFor me, the rules for setting up a BBC culture are still being developed but , what I do know is unless we attempt to develop a distinctive cultural identity that separates us from mainstream society, we may as well just stick to boring cake recipes, dogs in prams and FOB culture talk.
@AnonymousMay 2, 2012 12:26 AM
DeleteIf you are a BBC, are you happy with the BBC culture we have now? If so, what do you like about it?
Yes I am a BBC. To be honest with you, we don't have many BBC's here, mostly mainland Chinese people that have immigrated from China, HK or other parts of Asia. I don't hear many speaking Cantonese, mostly Mandarin. I think the BBC culture is slowly deteriorating and it's overtaken by mainlanders mostly. The only leftover BBC's for all I know, are either working abroad or moved another part of town. Whenever we eat out in the Chinese restaurants, they are mostly China students and not local born Chinese serving. I just keep myself to myself happy. I don't really associate with the Chinese Community Centre, as the only people that go are mostly the elderlys, mainlanders that cannot speak English and for people that have nothing to do, so they participate in Tai-Chi, Chinese Calligraphy, play Chinese musical instruments and so on. I doubt it if I can meet any BBC's that attend these activities or go to the Christian Chinese church lol. I tell you something funny. At one time I had to interpret for a Chinese lady in her late 40's at the jobcentre and okay, she was very thankful to me, then the next minute, she was pestering for my mobile number. She was telling me to go to the Christian Chinese church haha..as a result, I just pretended to say I didn't have a mobile haha..
DeleteSo in other words, in your own way, you are doing your own thing, with your own life. That Im guessing, sums up the lives of a lot of us. When we are surrounded by FOB culture, and we dont have a culture of our own, what culture do we have?
DeleteCulture of resignation.
Back on topic, in the face of the present situation, shouldnt we adapt? Shouldnt we make friends with mainlanders? Shouldnt we welcome all Chinese and care about what happens to them, good or bad?
Obviously we being a minority within a minority and as you say slowly deteriorating doesnt exactly put us in a good bargaining position, but maybe we can redefine our attitude as welcoming all Chinese in the UK and sharing our opinions about whats both good and bad side of being Chinese in the UK. Its as has been said before, as Chinese we are so dispersed and categorised and our natural tribalistic attitude whitewashed and beaten to death by selfish individualism that we see unity as some kind of impossibility.
I know BBCz has different ideas on this, but for me, if we somehow could start by ourselves up to each other, which doesnt necessarily translate as embracing FOB culture, but stating why we are proud in our own way, expressing that,through opening showing concern for others, which we are not known for, standing up to racism for others as well as ourselves,and as someone said on another thread, reaching out to others, it would be a start. Its either that, or backslide into the abyss.
Happy, mostly the people keep themselves to themselves, even with some gwai lo's & gwai poh's. I think in a way it's the best way to be. First of all, we are staying out of trouble and also, you don't know who's decent or not. For all you know, you might be dealing with a triad gang or some sort, and it's a big concern here for where we live. For me, I have been attending Mandarin lessons recently, but there wasn't much Chinese people in the class. There was a young guy that didn't want to talk and acted like he was at the top of the class, and the other girl had dropped out. My mother was saying to me a few weeks ago, she had overheard some mainland Chinese woman using her partner to stay in the UK permanently, so you expect me as a BBC to show some concern for her? Lol. Anyway happy, these people will get used to the country once they've lived here for a while, and they can seek advice from the border agency, Chinese Community Centre or the CAB for further help. That's what these companies are there for. As a past translator, yes we do discuss the culture of UK to the non-English speakers, but they are not supposed to get close to them because of the code of practice, and the job itself. Yes we can reach out, but how far will it get us? I don't think it will be very far, as we're living in a gwai lo's country.
DeleteI was thinking of working in China or HK in the future, as the demand in jobs are better there, than in the UK. I've heard some BBC's are already there teaching English or to find good paid jobs there, and of course, better chances in getting promoted. Why not give it a try happy?
DeleteRe: working abroad, being aware a lot of BBCs are happy abroad, there are always issue's wherever you are being an outsider. Don't have any opinions on that right now, but yes it's definately an option.
DeleteRe: first comment
Triads? Which area do you live in the UK? Re: Mainland Chinese woman, no, obviously not, and if shes a typical 'example' of a mainlander in your area, then probably you cant be blamed for not socialising too with mainlanders.
But re: reaching out, yes we are in a gweilo's country, but for me, it's basically about showing concern for ethnic Chinese and developing a strong enough political identity to defend our own ethnic Chinese people. Not sure if you read this:
http://bbczeitgeist.blogspot.co.uk/2012/04/police-car-kills-chinese-student.html
If you read that article, you can see our viewpoints on this blog.
1/Xuanwei Zhang is a mainlander, why should BBCs care?
2/What can BBCs do about it anyway being a minority?
Assumedly, those are probably the first 2 thoughts that appear in the head of a BBC, at least until someone wants to correct me.
By writing our condolences on that article, it shows concern for a Chinese visitor in the UK. That may not mean much, but as a guest blogger on here, having been made aware that a relative, i'm assuming, of Xuanwei Zhang has google +1'd that article, when searching for information on Xuanwei.
From a social point of view, that means a lot, because this 'blog' as a platform for BBCs enables us to show concern that we wouldnt be able to show anywhere else. If anything, that same relative, hopefully got some kind of condolences by reading the comments that we left.
In this respect, whilst we have our own issues, when it comes to reaching out to mainlanders, the above example shows that Chinese unity does have a purpose no matter what we care to make of the geographic dispersal issue.
Secondly, by showing concern, for this incident, by emailing to two Chinese organisations, though the results were negligable, we can feel we've done our bit, or as much as possible for a fellow Chinese.
That 24yr old Chinese student, is dead. He is not coming back. Killed by an 'emergency' police car officer who immediately after, was put back on the beat, as if nothing happened! That could easily have been a BBC. And if it was, how would we react? Would we be up in arms or would we just be discussing cake recipes on forums?
What the f-ck did British Chinese 'community' do for him? Nothing. We just got on with our own selfish f-cking lives not giving a shit. If BBCs and Chinese consciously connected in real - meaningful- ways, in our own media, take time to step out of our own little worlds, maybe we could all have spoken out and made this into the serious issue, that it is.
Ironically, asian americans, the culture that some of the facebook BBC'ers so idolise would have gotten up in arms about it? But us?
No, that news snippet got 18 comments on here, and now its history, onto the next piece of gossip defending Narissa f-cking Chan's right to wear a bra.
Understandably for dispersed BBCs, its a big step, stepping out and speaking out , but unless we do, and show some kind of consientious sympathy towards fellow victimised Chinese in our UK community, and those incidents that dont necessarily fit our selfish bubble,
it doesnt matter how many Chinese traditions you practice, dialects you speak, and groceries you buy, because at the end of the day your mindset hasnt progressed from a selfish FOB tribalist, 'doesnt bother me, so I'll look away' mentality.
IMO being a Chinese in the west, means showing concern for other ethnic Chinese, their problems, and offer help when we can, and not always about what as an individual you can gain from the situation.
Happy, you don't understand at all and please don't put BBC's down for not doing this and that. You can't force them to do things that they don't want to. I feel that you don't like the BBC's at all that live in the UK. We get horribly treated just like the rest of the Chinese minority. If say China had taken over the British colony, I think people would react differently. I've lived in the UK since I was born, so I know in a way how it feels to be isolated. Although we have a Chinese Community Centre, okay that's great, but still, racism would still exist in this society, no matter if we work for the gwai lo's/poh's, or passing by in the street or even buying groceries. I know that's terrible for the 24 yr old student getting knocked down by a police car officer, so why aren't his parents doing anything about it? I don't want to mention where I live..but anyway, did you read about the female hurling racial abuse to these fellow passengers recently in the tube station? So why aren't these football players that get racially abused come forward and represent us? They are the ones that have a reputation, so that would be a jolly good idea to support racism.
DeleteNot sure how you can say I dont like BBCs that live in the UK. Im a BBC. BBCz is a BBC. I have BBC mates. But If BBCs dont want to represent ourselves, I cant imagine getting any other football player who wants to represent our ethnic point of view. Do you know of a BBC football player who would speak out against racism? I dont even think we have one, do we?
DeleteRe: The Chinese student, I dont care whether his parents did anything, the point is that as ethnic Chinese in the UK, we should all care about what happens to other Chinese.
Also funny how there are some commentors who talk about ' hey stop the hate between HK'ers and mainlanders' and yet those same people dont give a shit about mainlanders when it comes to the above incident.
Why? is it too 'impractical' to share a moments condolences thought for another Chinese? All other human beings do this, why cant we?
You introduced yourself here on this blog, mentioned you had problems with white skavs in your area, you asked for advice, and I gave you some. Am I related to you? No, you are a Chinese, so I help. Or should I expect a favour in return? No of course not.
And If BBCs would only react different if China took over the British Colony, you are basically saying British Born Chinese pride is negotiable and relative to who is in power?
In that case, thats not choosing to recognize the power of a collective , thats just want to brush everything under the carpet and look away, and only pay listen when a white person calls your name.
So far reading the comments on this page, as to how we can react to racist slurs it goes:
ReplyDelete- ' go learn self defense!' ( selfish argument)
- ' dont be racist , it's wrong' ( multicultural argument)
- ' business comes first' ( selfish argument)
- ' use rationality' ( selfish / multicultural argument)
Is any one of the above, a genuine solution for a collective BBC identity? And if not, what is?
try looking at yourself
DeleteI was referring to the collective. Selfish attitude doesnt work all the time, you see.
Delete@HBC .Does that sound a bit like white-washed?cause some bbc or chinese women did that things been marked by you like white-washed, slut and so on?
Delete@AnonymousApr 28, 2012 03:21 PM
DeleteCan you explain yourself clearly, not sure what connection you're making between 'white-washed' and 'using racism to fight non-Chinese racists' is, and what this has to do with chinese women.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Delete@^
ReplyDeleteI disagree and think you are wrong because you don't really understand "racism" or maybe you do, and are using it in a way that is unusual or even illegal if actualised in work practice, and your justifications sound a bit convoluted because you haven't really explained why, but rather just forced a premise i happen to disagree. You don't have to agree of course and interpret my comments as naive or even passive. Fortunately racism its not a everyday occurrence for me, i never had slitty eye gestures since primary school, but i have complained about verbal racism once to my boss (not chinese), in which further action was taken and dealt with, person got the sack. there are ways to deal with racism tactfully, if i was to kick a fuss with counter-racism which i would never do, you have lost already. Actionless action is actually the most power form of action if you have an understanding and pride of chinese philosophy and culture.
I know nothing really...
Arent you mistaking taoism for apathy here? And if a taoist attitude worked for the collective, why are we still getting racist murders and beatings in the UK? Because the victims hadnt learnt to practice actionless action correctly?
ReplyDeleteI agree in a workplace, theres a time and place for everything but towards a spontaneous out of the blue offhanded public incident? How would you use actionless action to disarm the offender? And dont say you cant say because you dont know anything lol
Another blighter
ReplyDelete> What is wrong with the chinese ! But then what is right with them ?
- kev, Leeds, 28/4/2012 17:32
=============
I think this ties in nicely with ethnic Chinese identity and the lack of pride of being Chinese. When others disrespect, constantly point us out as "wrong - odd - cruel - barbaric", and racially abuse us with such venom - most of us in the community - seperate from other ethnic Chinese (who could relate and support each other) will give in to whites' stereotyping, through fear and pressure. it is a self fulfilling prophecy.
That is why Chinese pride is being eroded to extinction. Because of blatant, racial and widespread stereotyping and genuine hatred of others' towards us. We have been liked to Jews of the 1930s.... that's not far off...
Hugh Grant update:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RDQv5SZU5eM
Not only is Ellen (a lesbian who campaigns for equality, the irony) and her audience taking the piss with zero respect for the Chinese names, but so is Hugh Grant (predictably) - the white man who impregnated the Chinese woman in the first place!
I don't know how Chinese women can watch this and think "yeah, I want my kids to be MORE white, especially at the expense of my Chinese heritage"... usually when one's identity is ridiculed, they take offence, defend and fight for it. NOT GIVE IN AND BEND OVER.
actionless action isn't apathy that is the point.
ReplyDeleteokay but faced with the reality that these incidents happen on our own in public places,
ReplyDeletehow would it be put to work to effectively deal with racism against BBCs or our collective Chinese identity, or sudden offhanded public incidents/slurs of casual racism?
education,
ReplyDeleteI agree, the sinophobia is systemic. we have to re-assert chinese pride and write with the same racial superior arrogant manner rather like how white people write about china/chinese people, it means we have to be racist towards others.
ReplyDeleteQuite frankly, I dont care if some sections of the appeasing British chinese community tell me not to be racist to blacks, indians, whites, since those who hold such appeasing views are most likely sell outs who want to dissolve their ethnicity into the white community, its contrary to establishing a chinese identity and pride.
Care to elaborate?
ReplyDeleteIf some of us are willing to contribute more to sign up for a media, I would be happy to write some material for it, that deals with issues. Ive got an article, that if it gets published will give us the tools to get something done. But it takes more than just 2 people to be committed.
ReplyDeleteThe same people that comment on here that share opinions about racial experiences and negative experiences of how we are seen in media should also be willing to actively contribute if we are ever to get our own BBC media off the ground, that is for ourselves, and to educate non-BBCs reality what we go through.
it is so obvious from that article that whites' attitude towards chinese are far less uninhibited than towards other races.
ReplyDeleteAlso from a racial aspect, why do the whites continue to ignore their faults, then when they see others do the same they lash onto them? Canadians club baby seals, Norwegians and Japanese hunt whales, British hunt foxes (and there is no shortage of stories of dog abuse, shooting horses with crossbows etc.), Scandanavians eat deer and elk, Americans eat mongoose, deer, antelope and whatever the american wildlife offers... across South Asia and Africa they eat rats, dogs, cats and other small creatures for a bit of meat.... but when I see similar articles the comments are so much more tame, as if they were moderated (they're not) - but here it is open season on the chinese?
We need more beauty pageants for short stocky women and more guys doin Elvis impersonations and using charities as a front for tax evasion..oops I thought was on Dimsum website
ReplyDeleteLOL may as well bring a blow up Edwina doll to ward them off, thatll teach em
ReplyDeleteBtw, edwindy and AnonymousApr 29, 2012 11:22 AM
are you two the same person?
So back on topic, and for the benefit of helping/educating other BBCs, has anyone else been on the receiving end of inter-ethnic racism, or am I the only lucky one? And if so, how did you deal with it?
ReplyDeleteOk i'll start:
DeleteOnce on a bus, 4 black kids on the top deck. teenagers bopping their heads to their loud fonky rap on their portable discman or whatever was the inthing 7 years ago. One of had a gold pen that had a thin red pin-lazer beam sticking out of it. Sat not too far, one pointed that thing at my leg, started clicking it on and off, laughing. What is noticeable about blacks when they are racist to Chinese is that they tend to snigger a lot amongst themselves openly. Next thing I know that light was flashing on my face. I turned around and said to him' what did you do that for?' One of them said ' what you cant take a joke man?' I said' what if I did it at you - wouldnt be funny then would it? why dont you f-cking grow up'?
One of them started saying 'what you mean grow up' and I replied ' grow up, because youre acting like a child' luckily one apologised for the mouthy one with the pen, the bus stopped, the kids got off.
Similar thing happned ( white wiggerchavs) when one threw a snowball at my head and I had to ask him to put himself in my shoes when I was holding a handful of snow.
So no in both instances I didn't use reverse racism back at them, but assertiveness got the job done, and maybe was fortunate because in both cases being older than them.
Slightly related take look at this youtube skit called 'things white people say' - if BBCS started our own media, could be a stand up comedy way ( maybe Edison has an opinion on this) of dealing with racism and establishing our own style of Chinese pride.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fo_JjIYCWiw
Bit american, but you get the idea...
Really sad to hear your side of the story and good for you to stand up for yourself. I know you're a guy, but if it was a lady like me, I think they would do more than point a red laser beam at me. Men always see women as the weaker sex, so they would pick on them more. The guy on youtube looks like he has makeup on hee hee.
DeleteOpenly relating racist experiences to each other and how we dealt with it is something BBCs need to be more open about, because though it can seem like leaning towards dim-sum/british chinese online gushing territory, if all we want to do is save face and pretend everythings okay, we will never honestly evolve as a culture, and the same goes for any other area that we can be open to criticism to.
DeleteIt will take a certain amount of self-sacrifice from us BBCs to go from no culture to strong culture. And if BBCs dont want to share, and only save face, then nothing will change.
I've had racial slurs thrown at me by black kids...they seemed to think that it was ok seeing as the white kids did it.
Deletethats what gets me about blacks, they go on about racism, but they also adopt white practices, its called social engineering, endorsed by media and everything we read, another reason to avoid white culture.
DeleteThis kind of thing can also generate a self-hating nature amongst East asians/Chinese because you are taught how to see yourself by a western racist media. To develop Chinese pride, go against our social engineering, being racist to non-Chinese may seem politically incorrect, but as a racist defense its one way of breaking the 'cage' that as western born ethnices are taught to be mentally constrained by.
If BBCs/British East Asians adopt white culture, multiculturalism, and all the other stuff, rendered invisible,demonised by daily mail comments above, it doesnt really leave much room for cultural identity growth in an environment that clearly does everything to prevent that?
Sellouts and face-savers would argue this, because its in their interest to remain ignorant and selfish and want to be accepted by the mainstream. With our own media, we could take the time to try understand ourselves and accept each other individuals and to quote another BBC who wrote on his blog, 'the complex reality that we live in'
Again talking about racist experiences heals this taboo factor within our culture, because if FOBS dont teach you how to defend yourselves against racists and BBCs just dont want to talk about it to save face, you cannot build the foundations of a house on a gaping hole.
There's a reason why BBC women don't response to racial remarks made by the non-Chinese, maybe because they don't want to be hassled or even be killed? Sometimes they say, it's better to keep the peace than start a war? You just don't know what's going to happen around the corner. A few weeks ago, when my mum was buying the choi sum and some Chinese leaves from this White guy from the market. You know, what some Chinese men and Chinese women are like. They like to pick and see which looks fresh or decent right? As my mum arrived home, she was telling me that the White guy started yelling at her by saying" They're all the fucking same." I was very shocked. I had told my mum, why didn't she throw the stuff back to his face and answer fuck off, but she said, I won't bother going there again and just walked off.
ReplyDeleteI feel bad about your mum's expereince! many people didn't realize something. did't realize their own power ,,"people will treat you as the way you let them". my dear Chinese don't let them treat you the way you don't like.so my experience is always fight back harder!
ReplyDeleteand that feel good!
I would often tell my mum this, but she never listens. You know what mum's are like. They are very stubborn lol. If it was me buying those veggies, surely I would react differently. I would definitely say something back. I think it's terrible how they treat the Chinese people. As they say, what goes around, comes around, or 人在做..天在看.
ReplyDeleteyou need to chill out, you are too obsessed with "race"
ReplyDeleteKumbayah, my lord.
Delete有用的粗口 (useful swear words)
ReplyDelete1. 屌你老母
2. 仆街
3. 咸家鏟
4. 食屎
5. 死人頭
6. 死老鬼
7. 王八蛋
8. 八婆
1. Money
ReplyDelete2. Power
3. Protection
Where does 'Compassion' for other ethnic Chinese come in? Or is that function allowed for family and close friends only?
Deletehttp://www.usatoday.com/USCP/PNI/Nation/World/2012-04-12-BCUSCouple-ShotLos-Angeles9th-LdWritethru_ST_U.htm
ReplyDelete2 Chinese students shot in US, car stolen.
And on it goes...
If BBCs continue to refuse to wear blinkers and live in denial, instead of taking a positive interest in what affects us as Chinese, theres really no hope.
The logical answer is for you to establish yourself in China where you'll surrounded by fellow ethnic Chinese rather than deal with all the the whitewashed BBCs, racist whites and racist non-whites who you hate so much.
ReplyDeleteYes, its clearly a crime to BBCs to have any Chinese pride in the UK, I quite forgot. Thanks for reminding me.
DeleteThe previous anonymous poster has a point though, doesn't he. You seem to be so unhappy in Britain that I can't really understand why you want to stay here. I'd like to see an article by you justifying your decision to remain. Should make entertaining reading! :)
ReplyDelete@Anonymous2 June 2012 12:12
DeleteThere's a story about an obsessed American Jewish boy who trolls east asian activist websites as a strange way of getting revenge at a Chinese girl who refused to sleep with him, simply because he was so damn ugly.
But do you want to know what pissed him off the most?
...she didn't know the Chinese word for 'Antisemitic'! LOL
Hi everyone,
ReplyDeleteThought it might be good to tell something about myself before my comment: I'm a student in Britain, been there for 3 years. Originally from Northern Europe. I've studied Chinese language by myself for a couple of years. Chinese culture is something that I've been interested in since I was hardly more than 3 ft tall.
I'm very sad to find this type of attitude among the British Born Chinese. Racism in general makes me very sad, and as I have grown to be friends with and love several Chinese people I am very sorry that some of you have had to encounter such horrible treatment from other ethnicities (including white).
I'm also disturbed that some of you seem to think that the solution is to adopt an equally racist tone against 'whites'.
I have read so many hostile generalisations among the comments on this site, and particularly about white people. Many of them are assumably a counter-reaction to generalisations about the Chinese.
Then again, having read the derogatory comments about Chinese, you should know very well how it feels to try your best to be a good person and have other people still judge you merely on the basis of your racial features.
Do you not think many white, black etc. people are innocent of racist behaviour? Don't you think the white people who read/hear generalisations about their alleged horridness will feel equally hurt that they are being judged by their race despite their best efforts to love everyone?
Being white is a characteristic I can't do anything about. I don't want to be identified as a member of the group that abuses BBCs, since I don't do it, and no white person I'm close to does it either. I'm not one of the racist idiots who just happen to be white, and I feel hurt that I am being grouped together with them.
Because of my good experiences with Chinese people I know most of them are good people. How do you think those white people who, as I, try to get along with everyone, but haven't had the chance to interact with the Chinese to the same extent as I have, will react when they see themselves treated as one disliked group by the Chinese?
That's why fighting racism with racism is never the answer.
Being that your interest is in Chinese people from China, and not British Born Chinese, who you probably have no encounter/interest in, and language and the benefits that it can bring you as a white person, you are talking to the wrong crowd.
ReplyDeleteBecause at the end of the day, as long as your white privilege gets to benefit from Chinese culture, in the name of food, women etc, why should it matter to you?
Jump on the China exploitation bandwagon and away you go.
And you wrote that whole mini speech to tell US what to think? You whites invented racism, and now you see Chinese fighting back and think we should listen to you? Call it cultural exchange haha
ReplyDeleteThis is from a British Chinese expatriate to Sweden:
ReplyDeleteIn typical first conversations with Swedes, someone asks me where I’m from right off the bat, before they even ask me my name, and finds my answers unsatisfactory:
SWEDE: Are you from Japan? You must be Japanese, with that beard of yours!
ZAK: England.
SWEDE: What? Did you say Korea?
ZAK: England. Eng-guh-land.
SWEDE: What nationality are you?
ZAK: British.
SWEDE: So from Hong Kong then, or the mainland?
ZAK: Neither. England.
SWEDE: But ... where were you born?
ZAK: England.
SWEDE: But where are your parents from?
ZAK: You know what? I’m already tired of this!
SWEDE: So what’s your problem? You’re adopted then?
ZAK: Nope.
SWEDE: But where are you really from then, originally? You don’t look English.
ZAK: Have you been to London lately?
SWEDE: Uh ... No.
ZAK: Okay, a good portion of people from England look like me nowadays.
SWEDE: But you look like you’re from somewhere else. You should be proud of where you come from.
ZAK: I am! I told you I was born in England.
SWEDE: But your original family? Everybody is from somewhere. I can tell you where I’m from. Why can’t you?
ZAK: I just did. Your questions are invasive, rude and unfair. You can do better than that.
SWEDE: Unfair? You have to understand, we in Sweden are curious. Maybe we aren’t used to immigrants because we haven’t had that many until recently...
ZAK: Oh, that’s just bovine scatology!
SWEDE: Bova... scat...?
ZAK: Fancy words for good old-fashioned bullshit! One in 20 of your population is of Finnish decent. You’ve had immigrants from Yugoslavia for decades now, and an influx of professional elite such as the smiths and foundry-worker Walloons from Belgium centuries ago – they all just happened to be the ‘right’ color. Would you interrogate a blond-and-blue-eyed man like this if he said he was from Norway? His grandparents could be from Poland but this conversation would never come up.
Thanks for your post Wong.
ReplyDeleteI appreciate the fact that BBC are different from Chinese born in China. I can imagine that remarks like "go back to your own country" can feel particularly hurtful seeing that in Britain you are in your own country.
About the stereotypes of Chinese people you mentioned, like the ones portrayed in the American media, I obviously think they are offensive and unacceptable, and that their use should be stopped. The chocolate bar packaging in your picture was pulled from use since it was seen as racist.
Northern European countries suffer from similar problems as Britain in many respects. Immigration is not a new thing, (you may be surprised to find out that e.g. Finnish immigrants in Sweden have never been exactly loved! E.g. at one point Finnish kids were forbidden to speak anything but Swedish at school, even between themselves) but clearly immigrants of different races are. People need re-education, and I think definitely ethnic Chinese born in a Western country should raise awareness about this topic! I am willing to help as much as I can.
To be honest if you want to make racist comments to someone who first shouts racist abuse to you in the street it doesn't bother me that much. The point I mainly wanted to make to the writer of the above article was not to make it a public battle where you group all white people together, as that really will do more harm than good to ethnic Chinese in my opinion.
Also I'm from Finland.
Forgot to say that yeah, I get that most abuse will come from white people seeing that they are the majority and also the least experienced with how it is to cope as a member of an ethnic minority. I wanted to stress it by saying 'including white', but I've also gathered from the comments on this site that people have got abuse from other ethnicities as well.
ReplyDeleteOf course theres racism from other ethnicities. Any group living in the west,has been trained via media and derogatory advertising,about Chinese to shape what they know about Chinese. Chinese have a right to fight back with racism,as a verbal weapon, and even discriminate against non Chinese, exactly because we are a minority.
ReplyDeleteThere are plenty of sellouts who will kiss your white arse and beg you friends with you, and no matter what you say about you want to make friends with BBCs and whatever, you are not ethnic Chinese so obviously no matter how much you try and relate wont have experienced what we have and continue to go through.
Just because you deliver my post, doesnt mean I have to like you, and yes, being the majority im sure it works quite nicely in your favour. White advertising, white football Euro Jubilee, even in Chinatown. Cant get away from you. Because you rule and own everything. And you dont ever let us forget it.
And contrary to what you believe, in my opinion, having the right to exercise discrimination against non-Chinese WILL get what we want. Because a natural peaceful Chinese nature only ends up in having the historical piss taken out of us,because ultimately white westerners only respect war. Look at your barbaric Nordic history as Wong is trying to point out to you. If a war is what whites want, a war is what they will get.
http://www.bbczeitgeist.blogspot.co.uk/2012/07/simon-san-murder.html
Well, you've definitely made it clear that you don't like me. And that has nothing to do with me as a person, it only has to do with me being white.
ReplyDeleteI can try all I want to respect your feelings and take them into account in my behaviour, but it seems that will never earn me your respect for my feelings. I'll continue to respect the feelings of BBCs that experience abuse and hope that some of them will be less war-crazed than you. I'll also continue to make efforts to raise awareness about this topics among people of other ethnicities. I have not had the same experience, but you don't need to have had the same experience in order to be able to understand it's a serious fault in the society.
Then again, if you think I don't know how it feels to be part of a group that's disadvantaged in the society, you're wrong. Ethnicity or race is not the only ground for discrimination.
You've also clearly demonstrated that you haven't got a clue about Nordic history (and even less about Finnish history), not that it really matters.
From wiki
ReplyDeletehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Scandinavia
During the Viking Age, the Vikings (Scandinavian warriors and traders) raided, colonized and explored large parts of Europe, the Middle East, northern Africa, and North America, more specifically the modern area identified as Newfoundland.
Finland acting like a colonial power:
http://www.hs.fi/english/article/Finland+acting+like+a+colonial+power/1135249506199
The forest industry is closing factories in Finland, acquiring big land holdings in South America, and planting eucalyptus trees, ignoring the objections of the local people.
Finnish companies are building factories in developing countries, where wages are a fraction of what are paid in Finland.
This kind of thing used to be referred to as colonial policy.
Finnish utopian colonies:
http://www.sosiomedia.fi/utopia/english_article.htm
People were slow to learn the local language, and often the teacher was the only member of the community who spoke any language besides Finnish. Small wonder then that the Indian wives of Colonia Finlandesa Finns had to learn the Kitee dialect of Finnish.
At the start, contact with Finland was close, and the migrants received letters and papers. But as the years went by connections grew more tenuous, and even the South American colonies could be 'rediscovered'.
Hours of googling is not the same as knowledge, mate. Did you even read the articles you linked? Can you tell the difference between a historical fact of being a colonial power, and someone writing a provocative column to criticise Finland being in Afghanistan?
ReplyDeleteAnd also I hope you're not seriously suggesting that East-Asian Countries like China and Japan have not waged war at any point during their history, or had colonies, or imposed their own language on someone.
Oh yeah needed to add (since I have to correct most people in Britain on this) that Vikings did not come from Finland.
ReplyDeleteIn fact, even suggesting that Finland is somehow comparable to Western colonial powers (or Eastern colonial powers!) means that you really can't see the forest for the trees.
China has never waged war on the west. It is almost always the other way round. In original, all East asian countries were Chinese in origin, Japan, Korea, and Taiwan.Yet thanks to western infiltration and occupation,these three, and even Hong Kong, recently, have been used to turn against China.
ReplyDeleteChina does not colonise, if anything it has only seeked to reclaim what once belonged to her. No doubt you'll mention Africa as well but then you can look at who did the most damage to that country and its definiately not China.
The most 'damage' that China has done is to itself, including being overly hospitable to piss-taking whites. And it's too preoccupied with managing its own issues to be bothered with what the west thinks of it.
In a similar way, I dont really care about Finland or even for your presence on here.
This article is about empowering UK ethnic Chinese, or British Born Chinese who live in the west, who have had to put up with racism from arrogant whites and those who have been taught to think like arrogant whites.
Whether they choose to agree or disagree it's not for YOU, a white person,to tell ME, a Chinese, how to think.
If you enjoy the company of your whitewashed BBC and FOB friends, then you have more to be getting on with. That the second part of each comment above is insinuating that China is a colonising country either shows ignorance or you are trolling on purpose.
Continue to troll, and your comments will be removed.
Well, to be honest my intention wasn't really to talk about China. I only mentioned it since you started grouping all Western countries together and placing undeserved blame on all white people (which again is not to say some of them don't deserve it - it's just that they're not all the same). No need to accuse me of trolling.
ReplyDeleteAnyway I think we've both made our points and seem to disagree nevertheless. Wish you all the best and hope you don't break the law anymore than you already have (I would say some of your comments at least could be taken as hate speech). Farewell.
Breaking the law? Because you can't stand your oh so precious white male privilege being threatened by a Chinese who can actually see through your snakish agenda under the guise of 'volunteer work'? Haha. You weeaboo trolls are truly pathetic. Good riddance.
ReplyDeleteNot sure why you think I'm male though :P
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteEducation? Gosh, we've just been through that, some people just don't listen. Here
ReplyDeletehttp://bbczeitgeist.blogspot.com/2012/04/should-bbcs-to-be-racist-towards-non.html?showComment=1335500724088#c7056725114966498494
Multi-cultural education has been part of the problem all this time, not the solution, it does not empower British Chinese. In other words, you have no solution.
Admin Notice: Please refrain from personal insults or I'll start removing comments.
ReplyDeleteI'm sure hbc has some very bad experiences that has made him so angry, but I do have some idea how it feels. There was a time in my childhood that I was hurt by a foreigner. More than that, this foreigner was completely accepted by my family members and no one would believe what I said about him. It unnerved me for years to hear a similar accent to the one that person had.
ReplyDeleteThere are also situations like this: http://natashajsmith.wordpress.com/2012/06/26/please-god-please-make-it-stop/
I strongly believe that the people who are capable of doing this stuff, whatever race or nationality, are just not as human. We should take precautions and we should fight against them. And we shouldn't let our hatred define who we are or disturb our relationship with the other good people in the world, and this is also why I suggested that countering racism with racism is not a good solution.
Call me naive if you want, but I do think you see things more clearly if you don't let your rage consume you. The ethnic Chinese definitely have a place in the UK if you ask me, and can definitely be something special. Don't lose hope, the society is making progress.
Are you the Finnish person?
ReplyDeleteLook at this, a sample of comments from the most read newspaper in the UK: http://i.imgur.com/xoEgF.png
Of course, there are more. There are insults used against the Chinese on that site which wouldn't even be said about rapists, murderers or vagabonds.
"The ethnic Chinese definitely have a place in the UK if you ask me, and can definitely be something special."
I appreciate the optimism but its unrealistic. The mainstream media in the UK has an agenda to portray China anything to do with China (including its diaspora) as untouchables, the foreign and barbarian, the illiterate etc.
Also, aren't you only an exchange student? I can't believe that you've delved that deep into British society in such a short period as to come up with a conclusion like that. (don't take that as an insult).
"The number of Chinese victims of racist crimes appears to be small when compared with other minority ethnic groups. For example, in Greater Manchester they account for only 3.6 per cent of the total. But when this figure is viewed alongside the fact that Chinese people account for less than one percent of the total population of Greater Manchester, the gravity of the victimisation becomes clear.15"
"Whereas, nationally, the British Crime Survey results for 2003-04 show that the ‘Chinese and Other’ group has the lowest level of risk of crime victimisation than the other main ethnic groups18, empirical research has shown that Chinese people as a whole are more likely than any other minority ethnic group to be subject to racial harassment and racially-motivated property damage19. The Fourth National Survey of Ethnic Minorities20 found that 16 per cent of Chinese people in the UK encountered more racial abuse and insulting behaviour in the past year. This is more than other ethnic minority groups."
I can sympathise with your experience with the foreigner tale and Natasha Smith's story, but I don't see how those can act as an analogy to the experience of racism against British Chinese in the UK (other than the fact that they've negative events).
@BBCz why are you deleting my comment when this is an article about fighting racism? This is another ignorant white person trying to tell me ' Im sure Chinese will find their place' and then telling me China colonises the world when he/she knows shit about the culture of the people she is supposedly befriending.
ReplyDeleteHow patronising can you get?
@ Anonymous11 July 2012 00:26
You should have left when you had the chance. Unlike Wong, I dont appreciate the optimism. Your tone is just plain patronising. Who the heck are you to tell us where we are meant to 'fit in'. Slot quite nicely into this little hole, made for Chinese. No not that one, this one I made earlier. Do you think I give a shit about wanting acceptance from you whites? Many BBCs do, but before acceptance to remind anyone reading, first comes DING DING ...*respect*
As a typical white person you are just giving us your kumbayah bullshit. Clasp your hands and pray and the Daily Mail will just stop cranking out it's sinophobia, paint a smile on your face and maybe we will stop portraying hypersexualised images of women and keep the males invisible or just white-arselickers/eurasians.
You dont provide any real solutions. And until the racist agenda deeply rooted in this insidious country hates Chinese, is removed, as opposed to hidden under false pretenses, then we can hate back.
As BBCz said on this thread, if anything, Chinese should be the aggressors. But instead we bury our necks in the sand it to the point that cake recipes dominate our cosy lifestyle and we allow weeaboos to tell us sinophobia doesnt exist. May as well rename the blog British Born White arselicking eurasians and call it a day.
To disfuse -it was descending into something quite unnecessary. To claim white people invented racism is quite bold, Andrew Young and Dianne Abbott have said the same and such comments haven't exactly been well received by the white population, as you know whites hate being accused of racism and will take steps to stop ethnic minorities accusing whites of racism, so you have to be careful what you say.
ReplyDeleteWhilst it cannot be expected than non-chinese will know the nature of sinophobia, only those who are subject to it will know, however they can learn to empathize in their own way - not by wearing your shoes, but by comparing shoes. Though I must say the examples given were rather odd and not entirely parallel.
If any non-chinese supports the empowerment of ethnic Chinese without actually trying to speak over ethnic Chinese and without taking credit and witout some ulterior motive, they're good in my book, as long theyre not here to preach christianity, white multiculturalism etc.
No, as a decent human being, we should not be racist to anyone. However, I don't believe in staying silent either. It really depends on the situation; if there's a gang of shitholes (irrespective of their race) making racist jibes to me, I would sensibly ignored them. However, if the offender(s) is not likely to win in a fight, I would rebuke them and fight them if necessary. I have once took a calculated risk of confronting 4 white chavs in a car (in a petrol forecourt) who shouted abuse to me. One of the guy became so verbally aggressive that he looks like he wanted to fight. In the heat of the moment, I couldn't think of anything to say, except to saying aloud my thought which was like he looks like he want to fight, and so I said to him "Do you want a fight?". Simultaneously I step myself one foot forward in his direction. To my delight (and relief too), he immediately responded with a 'No' as he must have been scared by my readiness to fight him. Yes, sometimes we must be brave and fight back. In schools many years ago, I remembered almost coming to blow with a much bigger black guy, fought with a white kid, a white pubescent white girl who was much bigger than me, pulled the eyes of a Pakistani kid until he cried, and fought with a fat Pakistani asshole in the sixth form. I detest all racist bully, but to my eyes, racist bullies who are not indigenous white people are particularly despicable because they should know better.
ReplyDeleteYes its all about showing you are ready to fight back and assert your authority and not backing down. You sound like you had more obvious in your face experiences rather than being the brunt of the usual snide c-ntish remarks as can be the norm in some parts of the UK.
DeleteAs long as Chinese ( BBCS) dont believe in a collective ethnic social identity, because 'racism doesnt exist' the next best thing is as an ethnic Chinese individual, show you wont take crap. Assuming you are a BBC and ethnic Chinese,you stood up for yourself,outnumbered too.Thanks for sharing.
I have only recently discovered this very thoughtful and articulate blog; bbczeigeist and contributor like yourself have shown exceptional reflective opinions. Although I don't entirely agree with some of the very uncompromising and tough stance in this blog, you and BBCzeigeist are doing a great job in highlighting complacency and weaknesses in the British Chinese community (BBCs and FOBs). I will like to contribute more regularly soon, but currently I have to resist this very addictive blog so I can focus finishing my book which also discusses some of the issues mentioned in this blog. Then I will participate more often.
DeleteBtw, I am an ethnic Chinese and almost a BBC (came here at 10 from HK).
Keep up the good work, and hope this blog continue to glow and attract more interests from more BBCs and FOBs too.
Thanks, hope to see you here more often as a regular. The book sounds interesting look forward to hearing your viewpoints, or if ever you need any feedback, dont hesitate to ask.
Deleteno plagiarism! What is the book about? I'm interested to know more too.
DeleteThe book is very personal-an autobiography, hence it delves into some of the issues mentioned in your blog, such as identity, Britishness, being Chinese, China and racism. Its still a few months from completion, then I guess it will be another 6-12 months before it gets published through a major publisher. If I do become famous, I will definitely give your blog a plug(when relevant), as I have done already within my small circle of friends/acquaintances. I would be happy to get to know you and HBC as soon as the book is published. Gotta get back to the writing now!
ReplyDelete"education" about empowerment, the education thesis still stands, but the specifics vary or contested because opinions differ. If the conclusion is, nothing or little can be done, its still a conclusion albeit an unsatifactory solution.
ReplyDeleteIf there are unexplored theoretical potentials well lets debate it with some clarity preferably, needs a reset button.
I'm sorry that you hate everyone.
ReplyDelete